Comments on: Public Enemy No. 1: Unions

By: Davy Bui

Davy Bui — Sat, 24 Jan 2009 02:08:21 +0000

Hi Ray,

As with everything else in life, unions aren’t a simple matter of good/bad but varying, undulating shades of both. Though I wonder how 2 people manage to get sucked into 3 unions, they do serve a purpose.

UAW is a convenient strawman but we know that’s not the big 3′s biggest problem. Of course, if the big 3 had overcome their ideological bias and supported universal healthcare a few decades back, they might have be more competitive now.

Interesting to see that whole ruckus with SEIU and UHW out here in CA. Looks like a 21st century big labor power grab. I’m not privy to the details of the conflict but am inclined to side with UHW. If they want to secede, they should be able to do so — unions belong to the members, right? Sure.

Meet Andy Stern, the new Jimmy Hoffa.

By: Ray Tarkington

Ray Tarkington — Fri, 23 Jan 2009 08:58:14 +0000

I am glad you spent time as an organizer and have some insight into the pitfalls of union’s. You have placed your finger on the Achilles heel of union’s- that they can disconnect the workers from the need for the company to make a profit. The fact that you worked for a public union that probably had civil service work rules already in place and had no need for profit or competition made it abundantly clear.
I am glad that you also mentioned unions were also the best leverage the average worker could attain.
My wife and I belong to 3 unions. 2 of the 3 (IBEW electricians and SAG actors) do not have seniority rules and in my opinion are how all unions should be structured. The employer picks the most productive/ best suited worker, the union obtains the wages and benefits.
As far as the auto unions, they definitely used to suffer from the disconnect from competition I mentioned. Those days are over and I feel it is unfortunate that people like Mr. Simon believe that unions somehow affected design or reliability. I believe Dax is absolutely correct in describing the tremendous burden all manufacturing bears in competing with manufacturers that do not have to pay health and retirement costs directly. It is important to note that all European, Korean, carmakers are only non-union in America. Having said that I do believe it may be a waste giving the car companies bailout money without leveling the playing field and taking a much more proactive trading policies, including getting rid of our subsidies so we can demand all others do also.

By: Davy Bui

Davy Bui — Sun, 14 Dec 2008 18:06:35 +0000

A couple of points:

1) Bill M, on a personal basis, I agree with you. As a union organizer, I was part of a union and the structure of one is such that excellence is somewhat discentivized. Within 6 months of my arrival, one of the top honchos told me I was the best organizer she had. However, I was the most junior and thus lowest paid, with no hope of being caught up except for moving up.

2) On the flip side, it seems to me to be suicide to structure a 70% consumer-based economy such that the vast majority of consumers have little leverage to increase their income. So unions may be a petri-dish for mediocrity but frankly, that’s okay because most people are quite fine with mediocrity. However, Bernanke is now finding out what happens when you need people to spend money (on houses, cars, TVs, computers, etc) and they don’t have the money and can’t increase income. That’s not a fancy economic argument — it’s just common sense.

3) The lack of political balance or attempt at impartiality is dangerous because it propogandizes viewers, investors and executives, even if they resist. It is the nature of propoganda and humans that it works.

4) Any management team that cannot “win” a labor dispute with a union post-Reagan is completely inept and needs to be replaced immediately. The shift toward conservative business policies and American overconsumption makes it fairly simple to starve unions out. The workers, like most people, hardly save and the unions probably spend more on politics than on strike funds.

5) So much effort is spent demagoguing the UAW that most people don’t realize that the biggest union threats are county & state unions, especially SEIU. The thing that chaps my hide is the fact that CALPERS can lose a shitload of money and then notify their “members”, the various munipalities, that they’ll have to pay extra to make up for the shortfall. Where does that money come from? THE TAXPAYERS!!!! Why should we have to pay because a bunch of state workers and their pension fund can’t manage their retirement funds? Many of these guys can’t cross a street without a nanny but we have to pamper them for life??!!??

By: Trig Palin

Trig Palin — Sun, 14 Dec 2008 15:46:38 +0000

Unlike a non-union shop where you make a decent wage where you help your fellow workers

Like Wal-Mart?

By: Bill M

Bill M — Sat, 13 Dec 2008 19:47:47 +0000

The problem with Unions is that they create inefficiency because they create a work environment where you only do what you are required to do. Unlike a non-union shop where you make a decent wage where you help your fellow workers. I have worked before for a Unionized company and I could not take all the inefficiency and over paid workers.

By: Dax

Dax — Sat, 13 Dec 2008 15:57:47 +0000

I only caught part of the discussion on CNBC yesterday. But I thought Charlie Gasparino was appalling, trying to talk over the other speaker the entire time. On many occasions on TV Gasparino has both looked and sounded drunk, and yesterday he seemed to be completely off his face.

The lack of any attempt at a political balance on CNBC makes no sense to me.

US industry is collapsing under the weight of it’s healthcare costs. In most other countries these are not a corporate expense, so in the US they represent a huge surcharge on labor costs.

By: Thomas Simon

Thomas Simon — Sat, 13 Dec 2008 06:48:12 +0000

While the retiree benefits and union wages are a problem for GM and the others, it is not the biggest problem. Unions beside negotiating for higher wages, which is their job, also has been meddling with creating very rigid “work rules”, limiting management’s ability to flexibly use the work force. This is a much bigger problem, stifling productivity and undermining morale. But the biggest problem they have is that we the people stopped buying the junk they produce. I have not seriously looked at an American car for 20 years. Neither did most of my friends and colleagues.